Two empty chairs sit against a white background in a recording studio set. Text appears on screen that reads: "A conversation about harm reduction with Paul MacCartney, Victoria’s Chief Addiction Medicine Advisor and Sarah Hiley, Drug Checking Director The Loop Australia."
A man, Paul, and a woman, Sarah, walk onto the recording studio set, and sit down facing each other. Text appears on screen and reads: "with Paul MacCartney Victoria's Chief Addiction Medicine Advisor and Sarah Hiley, Drug Checking Director, The Loop Australia." Paul begins the conversation with Sarah.
Paul MacCartney, Victoria’s Chief Addiction Medicine Advisor: Sarah, we’ve heard a lot about harm reduction recently, can you tell us what it means in simple terms?
Sarah Hiley, Drug Checking Director, The Loop Australia: When we talk about things we do in everyday life, there's always risk to it.
So driving a car, there is risk of harm if you crash, which is why we put seatbelts into cars. So if you take harm reduction or that concept of harm reduction into drug use, what we're doing is we are not condoning or condemning drug use. We're accepting that it happens. And what we're doing is putting measures in place to reduce the harm that can happen from that drug use.
Sarah Hiley, Drug Checking Director, The Loop Australia: So Paul, where do you see harm reduction in Victoria heading? Are there new strategies or tools we should be excited about?
Paul MacCartney, Victoria’s Chief Addiction Medicine Advisor: There's a number of strategies, Sarah. So, under the statewide action plan that's being rolled out by the government, there's, we're looking at increasing people's access to the medications that can help to reduce the harms related to opioid dependence.
We're increasing the access to naloxone. So, the antidote to opioid overdose, in the general community, looking at having some vending machines around for people to be able to access very freely. We're working on the early warning system, and surveillance. So, we're looking at what drugs are out there in the community and being able to provide alerts to people so that they're aware of what might be happening. And then we've got, very exciting, process of drug checking that's happening at festivals and at a fixed site coming up soon.
Sarah Hiley, Drug Checking Director, The Loop Australia: What’s your take on why it’s so important for us to talk about harm reduction openly?
Paul MacCartney, Victoria’s Chief Addiction Medicine Advisor: I think we need to talk about harm reduction openly because we need to live in the real world. We know across society about half of the population, adult population, will have used an illicit drug in their lifetimes. 1 in 5 will have used in the past year. And so, we need to be working with acknowledgment that it is happening and helping people who are doing that, to be doing that in a safer way, as we can possibly arrange.
Sarah Hiley, Drug Checking Director, The Loop Australia: Again, if we talk more openly about harm reduction, we reduce the stigma and discrimination that goes with it, which means people feel they can speak up and ask for help or support or just advice and information when they need it.
Footage from a music festival panning over the crowd and stage.
Paul MacCartney, Victoria’s Chief Addiction Medicine Advisor: So, Sarah, we had our first mobile pill testing trial at a music festival. Can you tell us how it works? Do I just hand over a pill and wait, or what’s the process?
Footage of Sarah in the studio.
Sarah Hiley, Drug Checking Director, The Loop Australia: The first thing that's really important to know is it's not just pills. We more colloquially refer to it as drug checking because that really encapsulates a range of drugs that we can test. So that's pills, powders, liquids, crystals, things like that.
Footage from a music festival. A young person approaches Sarah at the drug checking tent. Sarah hands them an iPad to fill out a form.
First of all, they actually sign a disclaimer.
They'll then sit down with a chemist, and the chemist only needs to take a really small sample of that drug. So, it's about the size of a matchstick head.
Footage of Sarah and Paul talking to each other in studio.
They'll ask a few questions about what the person believes that substance to be, whether they’ve tried it, whether they had any unexpected experiences, them or their friends.
Footage of chemist analysing a sample.
The person will then either wait whilst we test the sample or in a festival setting, they'll often be given a unique number that links them to those samples, and they'll go away and come back at a later date.
Then we make sure that our advice is tailored to the results and also what the person's reported back to us.
Footage of harm reduction worker chatting with a young person at a festival.
So it's a real opportunity to speak to people about drugs and drug use in a non-judgmental and safe, confidential space without fear of judgment.
Footage of Sarah and Paul talking to each other in the studio.
What we found at our most recent festival is nearly 40 per cent chose to use less based on the results and the information that we've given them.
So we're seeing some really great health care outcomes of people deciding to do something differently to what they would have done if they hadn't visited the drug checking service.
Paul MacCartney, Victoria’s Chief Addiction Medicine Advisor: Sarah, for people who might feel nervous about using the drug checking service, what advice do you have for them?
Sarah Hiley, Drug Checking Director, The Loop Australia: First and foremost, here in Victoria, that law has been changed. So you are safe from prosecution when you bring a personal amount of drugs into a drug taking service. The second thing is it's confidential and anonymous. So legally protected, confidential and anonymous and you can choose what information you give us.
Sarah Hiley, Drug Checking Director, The Loop Australia: So Paul, some people are concerned drug checking may encourage drug use. How do you respond to these concerns?
Paul MacCartney, Victoria’s Chief Addiction Medicine Advisor: The evidence is from around the world where there's been many drug checking sites, both based at festivals and fixed sites that, it doesn't increase the use of drugs. We know that this helps people, helps reduce harm to people and enables people to be connected with health services.
And that's, that's really where we want to, what we want to start, is that conversation for people to be able to say, I can seek out services and not be judged and get the supports that I need to.
Interview ends and a white screen appears with text, which reads: "To learn more, visit health.vic.gov.au/alcohol-and-drugs/pill-testing." Video ends.
End transcript.
Back to Victoria's pill testing trial.
Reviewed 01 May 2025